One or Two?
Images & Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

marcus, tucker, clark, marianne, lillard, drugs, testify, evidence, jury, shockley, hot tub, phone calls, case, asked, died, inmate, coffey, state, call, courtroom

SPEAKERS

Judge Burleson, Marcus's dad, Recorded message, Penny, Marcus's mom, Marcus Lillard, Mr. Tucker

 

Penny  00:06

 I'm Penny Dearmin. This is season two Blood Town on Trial

 

Penny  00:12

on Friday, April 8 After lunch, ADA Coffey calls Chris Youngblood to the stand. He's an investigator for the Baldwin County Sheriff's Office. As part of his duties, he monitors and investigates jail calls. He confirms that inmates are informed that their phone calls are monitored and recorded. He says that this system that the Baldwin County Sheriff's Office uses to monitor and record jail phone calls is Securus. Each inmate has a unique inmate identification number that stores their recorded calls in a cloud based system. Here's a little background information on Securus Technologies. They charge 16 cents a minute for in state calls, or $2.40 per 15 minute phone call, which is how long each call lasts. Depending on many factors, inmates may call the person back or make back to back phone calls. Each time you add money to your online Securus account, you are charged a $3 fee. The Georgia Department of Corrections receives 59.6% of the gross revenue that Securus makes off of inmates and their friends and family. Securus also paid Georgia a one time $4 million dollar financial incentive at the initiation of the contract with a minimum guaranteed monthly payment by Securus to Georgia of $325,000. According to the Prison Policy Initiative, the annual cost to families of prison phone calls and commissary purchases in the US is $2.9 billion a year. Securus. You may start the conversation now [recording that is played at the start of every jail phone call]. Back in the courtroom, ADA Coffey publishes state exhibit 146 to the jury, which is comprised of four calls placed by Marcus Lillard while in the Baldwin County Jail. The first call is between Marcus and his dad. They don't tell us the date and time until after the entire call is played. But it is May 14 2019. We understand that it is shortly after Marcus's arrest because they're talking about Marcus being on the front page of the paper and what the GBI is still trying to figure out. Marcus says the GBI is convinced he did it because his DNA is all over her body. He says it's from the CPR when he touched her all over. The recording is especially rough as the courtroom is filling up. People who got out of work or classes early are keeping us close together and bless him Sheriff Massee keeps unwrapping his candies as reporters type away

 

Marcus Lillard  03:19

Clark was a devil, that's all I can tell you, Clark was a devil. He drugged us. I mean, I can't really explain it, it's like a nightmare, but I didn't do it, I promise you I didn't do it. Like I walked off in a Trance into the woods for over an hour. I came back and she was floating in the hot tub she was already unconscious. I got her out of the hot tub, I started doing CPR. I tried to move her, and when I moved her she fell, and that's when, that's when she died. God told me a couple times, there's a silver lining in this somewhere. I don't know where or when, But there's a silver lining gonna come out of it. But I don't think I'm gonna ever come home. I mean I Can't even  explain it. just all of a sudden I was in a trance and Marianne's in a trance.

 

Marcus Lillard  04:03

 We got there at like 7 o'clock. At 9 o'clock, we were  actually getting ready to leave. And he said, here, here's one more beer. That's when he got us. He handed us a beer that was laced with something.

 

Marcus's dad  04:06

What time was it? When y'all got there?

 

Marcus Lillard  04:22

We had had the best day, too, daddy. I mean, just laughing and having a good time. I mean, everything was great, and it just changes in a second. But the good news is that I'm going to be fine. Nothing bad is gonna happen. It's Almost like my whole life has been leading towards this for me to spend the rest of my life in jail. I even had that thought last week a couple of times. Eventually, I'm gonna spend a long time in jail. That's where I'm gonna really find God. But I ain't even worried about me and my future. I'm more worried about Sandra, Elsie, and Nora at this point. Love y'all.

 

Marcus's dad  04:58

Love you too.

 

Penny  05:00

The second call is May 16 2019. Again to Marcus's dad. Marcus says he just came back from going back out there meaning Clark's house with the GBI. Marcus had offered to go back out there and walk around and see if it would jog his memory. In the previous call. Marcus's dad asked if they drew his blood for a tox screen and Marcus said no, they took a pee test so they probably wouldn't find anything. Marcus's dad says they will find it on Marianne. His dad asks if they said anything about the tox screen yet and Marcus tells him it will be a while Marcus is breaking up and it's very hard to hear what he's saying at times. He says that he knows he was drugged that night, and that Clark was known for liking Molly and that night that he partied at Clark's with Carson, other people were doing Molly and Marcus didn't do it because he doesn't like the manmade stuff

 

Recorded message  06:04

An inmate at the Baldwin county jail. This call is subject to recording and monitoring. 

 

Marcus Lillard  06:09

I went out there to take the man the damn mural. I didn't go out there to tee up, team up, who the hell would do that? I mean that makes no sense. None. This is gonna be ugly. Daddy I'm so sorry because it's gonna be embarrassing for y'all. There's a part of me that almost wants to just...and yet  they're so good at that part, playing with your heart strings. This is their exact words: for one time in your life be a man so your son'll be proud of you for stepping up and doing the right thing. Confessing to something I didn't do ain't the right thing and I mean, I'm not gonna do it. I'm not going to do that. I'll do everything else, but I'm not going to confess to something I didn't do.

 

Penny  06:51

the third call is on February 9 2022. From Marcus to his mom. Most of it is her telling him about her day but then Marcus is talking to her about his attorney Mr. Matthew Tucker

 

Marcus Lillard  07:07

And also, I wanted to see if he called Ayla yet, which I think is very very very important. Because once they once they aren't mad at me anymore or think they have a reason to be mad at me all of this will go away, but as long as they still think that I did it, then the DA and them's gotta kind of cater to them in some kind of way. Nothing good is gonna happen until somebody talks to them. I feel like that's by far the most important step is for him to let Ayla know how Marianne died, and when I talked to him last, he kept saying stuff about Clark. Clark ain't got nothing to do with nothing no more. Okay, so I want to make sure that he ain't going in there with that angle also because that's over with. We're not gonna blame it on Clark anymore cause Clark didn't do anything. 

 

Marcus's mom  07:56

Well, we don't know that for sure.

 

Marcus Lillard  07:58

We do know that for sure. she's got brown vomit on her upper body. She threw up in the hot tub and died. That's all there is to it. It's just that simple. Anything else is a lie. And it's been worrying me to death; he's going to go in there and try to do the easy thing, which is to blame it on Clark, but it ain't Clark's fault. Clark should've called 911 too

 

Marcus's mom  07:58

That's right.

 

Marcus Lillard  07:59

Especially since it was his house and his phone and he was the most sober of the three of us. She was dead, so it didn't matter how sober she was. 

 

Marcus Lillard  08:36

If he's got any intention of blaming it on Clark at any point, the We gotta, we've got to regroup on that because I'm not gonna let him be accused of that no more. I already did it, It's no. I want to make sure that that ain't part of his strategy. He needs to call Ayla and then everything's still on and then he's gonna come by here first. 

 

Marcus's mom  09:01

Okay, I'll call him.

 

Marcus Lillard  09:02

According to Matt, he's already had his medical expert look at it. So if his medical expert's already looked at it, there's no reason to point the finger at Clark, period. We can't just do that because it's the easy thing to do. I'm going for truth And the truth is she got in that hot tub with a heart condition. She mixed all the alcohol and the mexican food and she took an X pill on top of it. And she threw up and when she threw up it got caught in her small esophagus and she died. It took her six minutes to die because that's how long it takes to die from not having oxygen. So even if I had've been standing right there with 'em, it would've happened. And would have called 911 the second I saw, it still would've happened. But even as it is, she was dead when I found her: period, point blank. And that's really all Matt needs to just hear just like I told you. That exact way. It would be good if I could say it the exact way that I said it, but it'll be Just  as good if you say it the way I said it the same way. She died in six minutes Because she died from lack of oxygen to the brain and that takes six minutes. so there's no involuntarily manslaughter, because she was dead when I found her. But Clark did not kill her, and if he's even thinking about going that route, then we've got to stop everything. What the best thing he could do is to get me a bond, and then learn the case if they think they will still go to trial. But there's, there's not even a reason to go to trial.  I mean, Ashley told me  from the very beginning. The only concern they had was if I had called 911 that she would still be alive. We already know that's not the case. So there's nothing else to talk about. There's no trial to have, and there really shouldn't even need a bond, they should just drop it, but I don't want him to do anything, or point the finger at Clark because if he ain't called Ayla yet, why not?

 

Marcus Lillard  10:46

Because that's who needs to know what the truth is, before anything dealing with me. I asked him last week, you asked him  the week before so it is

 

Marcus Lillard  10:57

they need to know how she died, and if he has this medical expert look at it, then That's what they need to tell 'em is what the medical expert said. But it would be good if you went in and just told him all that. That'll give them a whole bunch more time to be thinking about the truth. So, no Clark, call Ayla, she died in six minutes so there's no involuntary manslaughter, there's nothing else to talk about. I need a bond. They can dead dock it, whatever they need to do to figure out how they will face. Alright, love you, bye.

 

Penny  11:31

The fourth call was on March 22 2022. It's another call to his mom. He's reiterating how the Shockley's need to know that it's 100% possible that she didn't die at anybody's hand that she died on her own. And nobody's told them that yet. Marcus says it's been two months since he asked his attorney Matt Tucker to call Ayla and tell her what he thinks happened to Marianne and he hasn't done it yet. He tells his mom to call Matt again or ask his friend to do it or however she wants to do it but they need to know. Marcus says, "Matt sucks." In the courtroom as this is played, Marcus kind of pats his attorney on the back as an apology

 

Marcus Lillard  12:16

You can explain it however you want to, but you're the right one to do it because you know enough about that autopsy to explain the heart, the vomit, the this, the this, I mean, whatever you want to do. Matt sucks, so. But the main the main story is there's nothing wrong with her neck. There's not even any bruises on her neck and then if she had been strangled her larynx would have been crushed. Regardless of all that stupid stuff Matt is talking about her bone being broke, her throat would be crushed. He wouldn't have to break the bone. I don't know about all that. But there would be damage to her neck from the outside and certainly somebody doing an autopsy would notice, too. There's no way the vomit would be on her outside after she'd been strangled. Tell Ayla about the heart, do whatever, but let them start thinking in another direction please. I think you're probably the one because you're so sweet. There's nothing, Ayla's not a mean person by no means. I never fooled around with Marianne that night and if I did, Marianne was a lady and I treated her like a lady. [BLEEP] is a slut, and I treated her like a slut but I never choked her out. I just treated her like a slut. She's butt hurt because she ended up being a crack whore wherever we broke up. And she blames that on me that she slept with half the hood for drugs because I broke up with her and set her off the deep end. that's what this whole thing is about. Alright, let's pray. Thank you so much for this phone call Thank you For my mom who's done everybody I've ever needed her to do. Lord,  Bring strength on this phone call to brining healing to the Shockley's and  bring them peace of mind and open their minds to think about the case in another direction, and bring closure to all this. In Jesus' name, Amen.

 

Marcus's mom  14:09

Amen

 

Penny  14:13

On cross Mr. Tucker asks how many phone calls Marcus Lillard placed and Detective Youngblood says approximately 1200 When asked he says that he did not select the phone calls played today. If anyone is keeping up 1200 times $2.40 is $2,880 in phone calls alone. ADA Coffey says the state rests. Judge Burleson asks the jury to return to the jury room and take a break; the courtroom is that a load in as the jury leaves next Mr. Tucker asks for an acquittal based on the fact that no one identified the defendant. You know the TV show courtroom scene and you hear Do you see the accused in the courtroom today and the witness usually points to the defendant, who has their head hanging low. Mr. Tucker also asked for a directed verdict making the argument that a reasonable jury could not find the defendant guilty. The state did not prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt for aggravated assault, because the medical examiner could not prove that Marcus Lillard was the attacker, or whether the strangulation was done with two hands or one hand,

 

Mr. Tucker  15:38

I asked, can you tell if it's one hand or two, and she couldn't get that get that answer, if it was one or two, she could just say that that was a, an act, that was the causation of the death, and that it was done with pressure and she wouldn't say intent. But she said compression was the part that was meant to cause strangulation. So they have not carried their burden to prove felony murder, because they have not proven the felony, the act of strangulation. They have not shown sufficient to the court beyond a reasonable doubt that it was two hands that were used in the process of their theory of strangling Miss Shockley. The reckless conduct would have to come to be a gross deviation. And the disregard of personal safety that a reasonable person would have used. Now a gross deviation would have been not attempting the CPR, not calling individuals in the medical field that could have assisted, but the natural reaction was to Get her out of the water. And let's start CPR. And that's not a gross deviation. That is something that shows there was an attempt to revive a body, whether it was it had already passed or not. The phone calls to a respiratory therapist to an EMT, to all the others under those conditions. Under that mindset, he was doing everything he could to try to revive. If he called 911, he would've talked to an EMT, who would have talked to an operator who would have tried to assist him in the same manner as he was reaching out to these other people to tell him what to do in that circumstances. So that would not be considered a gross deviation of a reasonable minded person to do in that circumstances. Therefore, I don't think that carries the burden beyond a reasonable doubt. And as to the felony murder, it doesn't give rise to felony murder because the strangulation aggravated assault was not proven beyond a reasonable doubt. It was never shown that Clark, I mean that Marcus here, used two hands, hell it wasn't even shown that Marcus did this. And just because there's some fetishes going on behind closed doors, nothing was proved that that was something he would do to Marianne. And the DNA tested that there was no sex that occurred that day. So as for the evidence being presented by the state, nothing has given rise to prove and show the court that he attempted, did or even tried to strangle her, not through his practices behind the closed door, they always said was one hand and not through any kind of bad character evidence that was presented. So therefore I'd asked the court to dismiss the felony murder and aggravated assault because there was not any evidence that was beyond a reasonable doubt that would ever show that he did that

 

Judge Burleson  18:42

response from the state.

 

Penny  18:44

ADA Coffey says Judge, we have enough evidence to send this case to the jury on counts three and four, because the respiratory therapist instructed him to call 911 and in fact called the defendant back to make sure that he did so. He said, No, she's fine. She's fine. Everything's fine. ADA Coffey says this is a circumstantial case. The medical examiner testified that Marianne Shockley died from manual strangulation. In fact, she said it was a textbook case of manual strangulation. It wasn't a heart condition. It wasn't an overdose of ecstasy.

 

19:22

The medical examiner testified that it was deliberate. Judge there were three people there that night, two are deceased. Several witnesses were formal sexual partner. So the defendant testified that he lied straight when during sexual intercourse, and in fact, defended his own state. So the woodshed during sex.

 

Penny  19:43

ADA Coffey says Clark Heindel's sexual partners testified that he didn't choke them during sex. Questions as to the reasonableness of hypotheses are generally to be decided by the jury. The evidence the state has presented It is sufficient to authorize a rational jury to find the defendant guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. So we ask that you deny defense counsel's motion for a directed verdict as to identity. ADA Coffey says it is not an issue in this case. All of the witnesses who testified said they knew the defendant, had known him for years. His own Son testified; she asked that the judge deny the motion for acquittal. Judge Burleson rules against him as they go through the charging documents before the jury is brought back in for closing arguments. She swears Marcus Lillard in and points out that the jury is the factfinder for the indicted case, and she is serving as the fact finder in his probation revocation case,

 

Judge Burleson  20:49

questions I ask, you will apply both to your trial and your probation case. Okay. Do you understand that in both the jury trial, and in your probation revocation case, that you have an absolute right to testify? And that if you want to testify, nobody can prevent you from doing so? Do you understand that? 

 

Marcus Lillard  21:10

Yes your Honor.

 

Judge Burleson  21:11

Okay. Do you understand that by the same token, no one can make you or compel you to testify that is that you have an absolute right to not testify if you do not want to.

 

Marcus Lillard  21:24

Yes, your Honor.

 

Judge Burleson  21:26

 Okay.

 

Mr. Tucker  21:26

Your honor, I believe we're gonna put up any evidence. I think he's gonna park it here and be in hush. Right?

 

Judge Burleson  21:33

Okay, well, that says question to answer, So Mr. Lillard, do you personally want to testify in the jury trial of your case or not? 

 

Marcus Lillard  21:40

No, ma'am.

 

Judge Burleson  21:41

Do you personally want to testify in the probation revocation case or not? 

 

Marcus Lillard  21:45

No, ma'am.

 

Judge Burleson  21:45

Okay, then, Mr. Lillard, I do find that you've decided to not testify and with a complete understanding of your rights.

 

Penny  21:56

The jury is brought back into the courtroom. And Mr. Tucker begins his closing statement.

 

Mr. Tucker  22:03

Like I said at the beginning, there's one thing that stayed the same. That arrow is still in the tree. And the state's evidence could not paint A bullseye around Mr. Lillard. If you look at all the evidence, I said, if you looked at the evidence and you listened, the answer would be there; the answer could be found. So as we started the trial, it began with an ex-wife coming up and not too high on, doesn't have Mr. Marcus Lillard too high on her list of people. But she came in, she started what I would call a lot of bad, bad things to say about somebody. A lot of bad opinions, a lot of issues with Mr. Lillard, none of those issues had anything to do with what occurred that night, on May 11 2019. And before that, there were evidence of the officers coming in saying, Hey, I was there. I ran around, and I put the tape all around facilities and it started raining. So we kind of stepped back. Some of the evidence that they put cards or they marked off by accident it had something to do with the case but because of the rain, it doesn't look like any of the evidence from that, DNA, Or being able to find DNA was unavailable. it still doesn't mean that it was there. There was a theory put out there. And that theory was that Marcus Lillard strangled Marianne in the hot tub. No one said he jumped in the hot tub and strangled her. There's a lot of circumstantial evidence. There was a lot of issues and factors. And the main factor was that there was a gentleman called Clark Heindel. And it was his house, and it was his drugs. And it was his intent. Although he's not here to tell us, to cause harm. And it may not have started that way, but drugs have a way of impacting individuals and drugs have a way of altering people's mind.

 

Penny  24:27

Mr. Tucker says, as this story and theory continues, they didn't want to bring out certain evidence, the cups close to the hot tub full of unknown liquids that may or may not have drugs in them. He says they couldn't testify because they weren't the ones who tested them. The shorts that were right in front of the hot tub. Maybe/Maybe not, but we didn't really do anything with them. These shorts had underwear near them, and no testimony was given that Mr. Lillard had underwear. We don't  know whose shorts they were, or why they were there. But we do know one thing. There was a period of time when the drugs started affecting Mr. Lillard's thinking and memory and he walked out into the woods. Mr. Tucker says when Marcus tried to tell the officers more of what he remembered, they didn't want to hear it. They had their theory,

 

Mr. Tucker  25:24

And in their theory, they were given the latitude to lie to him, to pressure him, to sit there and just flat out lye to him, in the state of distraught in the state of I don't know what happened. I remember this, but I don't remember this. And he had all these ant bites and scratches all over him. And he was talking to 'em when he itching, he was, was all over the place when he was trying to talk to 'em. Still over the effects of that drug, a drug that was given to him by Clark Heindel. Now, the levels were tested in Ms. Shockley, and they were very high, at one point nine. But they didn't test Mr. Lillard's blood to see what kind of levels he had in him. When he said he was under the influence of drugs, he's on probation. So he's doing something wrong. So we start with, okay, you got drugs in your system? Let's talk about women he's been with. Every one of those women are alive. And here to talk about the sexual fetishes and what happened behind closed doors. Every one of them said it was consensual. And every one of them walked out of it with no complaints. Heck, half of them stayed there and came back. What does that really have to do with Anything that happened on May 11th?

 

Penny  26:51

Mr. Tucker says the medical examiner testified that someone put their hands on her throat, compression enough to cause that individual to go into an unconscious state, or it was meant to do more harm. But it wasn't hard enough to break the hyoid bone. She says in strangulation cases, it often does break that bone, he says you must put it to yourself, who would have had the ability to break that bone, a young man or a 69 year old man who was under the influence of drugs who didn't have the strength to break that bone. Mr. Tucker points out that they didn't present evidence of other damage to her body from CPR because it didn't support their theory. It's true that Marcus wasn't respecting women wasn't respecting relationships like he should have. But he sure liked that Marianne Shockley, and she was something else. And she was going to take him out of all that. He quit his job because he enjoyed going on these trips with her. He enjoyed seeing her in her element.

 

Mr. Tucker  28:01

But all of that was just her personality, who she was God bless her soul. She's up there looking down and she's shaking her head saying please, please come to the right decision. Because she knows what happened. Clark Heindel knows what happened that day. And as much as Marcus Lillard wishes he could, he can't. And he's racked his brains. And he's gone over everything he did. And he came to a conclusion and that's what he has to live with, the pain he's endured all this time. He doesn't know; the family doesn't know. The state doesn't know. But no one ever came up here and said, Yeah, Marianne told me he squeezed my neck and she didn't like it. Marianne never said anything that, you know, during sex, he got rough or whatnot. And if he did, it would have been marks. It would have been evidence there would have been signs and DNA and redness and all kinds of stuff that we know technology nowadays has. And they didn't use that technology. They didn't want to explore all these ant bites because you saw those ant bites. It made my skin crawl like what they're looking at. Could you imagine the red ants crawling upon you biting you? Somebody would have moved somebody would've gotten the heck out of there.

 

Penny  29:36

Mr. Tucker says Marcus had that feeling. We've all had that feeling somebody's looking at her a little different. He doesn't need to look at her that way. Marcus sat back and didn't want to point a finger at Clark didn't want to judge anybody.

 

Mr. Tucker  29:52

And as the pieces were Coming back he knew for a fact it wasn't him. That's why they couldn't break them with their lies, their deceit. Keeping him in his cell and talking to him,

 

Penny  30:03

Mr. Tucker says you've heard a lot of evidence you probably didn't want to hear. Probably didn't need to hear. You heard a lot of bad character evidence saying he's not the nicest guy in the world. He's somebody you don't want your daughter around or he's a loser. But you know what, being a loser doesn't make you a killer. Being a loser doesn't make you the only suspect that you pursue. 

 

Mr. Tucker  30:31

So all of this bad evidence about girls saying well he did this behind closed, he did that, that wasn't a lady. That wasn't the lady he wants, that was the one that he wanted to quit his job and go to Ecuador with,  start a relationship and continue and he won't get that opportunity because he charged with murder. Murder caused by strangulation; but nothing, no evidence. No circumstantial evidence put him in that hot tub strangling her.

 

Penny  31:08

Mr. Tucker says Marcus didn't call 911 Because he was on probation. He didn't want cops coming out to see there was drugs and alcohol involved. Marcus did want to know what happened to Marianne, wanted to believe it was the drugs didn't want to believe anyone was capable of that, let alone someone who was a therapist to his son. Mr. Tucker says after Clark broke up with his last girlfriend who said Clark was calm but only saw him use marijuana a couple of times. Clark then started having these parties and they included drugs and women who were a lot younger than him and included a lot of sporadic wild acts. Clark was supplying drugs at these parties. Clark was quiet on the body cam, never once said he saw Marcus do anything to Marianne. If he saw something, don't you think he would have said something? That's his house. He was there the whole time in the shallow end of the water, then up on the porch. They didn't even notice if his shorts and T shirt were wet. This is something that should have been accounted for. This is all evidence. They let Clark go inside and he wrote a note. And nothing said Marcus did anything wrong. Mr. Tucker goes back over everything Marcus did to get help for Marianne. He says all of these people could have called 911. They heard the distress. They saw the confusing texts. They didn't call 911.

 

Mr. Tucker  32:47

and if They thought bad of him. Why wouldn't they do it to the other individual? They're going to try to continue to put a little bit more paint up there to say, well, it's not murder, that's  harsh. You gotta look at it different from that. It's not strangulation because no one ever said he was there. No one ever said that he'd done it. Nobody proved anything that he ever put his hands around her neck.

 

Penny  33:12

Mr. Tucker says so let's try involuntary manslaughter. They're saying he's doing an unlawful act of reckless conduct, a gross deviation of what a reasonable person would do to protect and not disregard the safety of another

 

Mr. Tucker  33:29

gross deviation. Immediately pulling her out of the water, immediately started CPR. Is that a gross deviation? Calling a respiratory therapist calling an EMT. Is that a gross deviation?

 

Penny  33:44

Mr. Tucker says it doesn't matter what he did, this lifeless body that fell with him had already made it to heaven. Mr. Tucker doesn't use Clark's name. But says the only theory that has evidence because of the manner of death that the doctor talked about the taking of his own life because he didn't want the pain that he had caused on those friends and family. Mr. Tucker is speaking from Clark's perspective here.

 

Mr. Tucker  34:15

I don't know what happened. I don't know what happened because you know, I don't know what happened. But he sure as hell knew that it wasn't Marcus so he would've put it in that note. he sure as hell knew that it wasn't Marcus, because he never once said that Marcus was there. He said he was in the woods. He's not a suicidal man, and he'd already made it through the terrible tragedy of losing his son. He was in a dark place. He started to have wild parties. He started having drugs and people dancing and jumping and playing music every Sunday. That wears and tears on a body, particularly somebody at the age of 69. And as he stood there, not really wanting to engage with the police. Not really wanting to call 911. Remember, he had a phone, he could've called 911. But if he called 911, it would've exposed What had occurred there? What occurred there was a tragedy, a terrible, terrible accident.

 

Penny  35:16

Mr. Tucker says, "that Marcus Lillard had nothing to do with." He says whether it was an on again off again girlfriend, he loved that person

 

Mr. Tucker  35:29

And no one ever got up here and said he was violent or aggressive to Marianne ever. No one, and No evidence was put up ever that showed he ever put his hands on Marianne. That he ever put his hands around Marianne's neck that he ever intended any kind of harm to any female. He did what he did behind closed doors that's the same thing a lot of people do. But just because he does that doesn't make him a bad person, doesn't make him a killer. And just because drugs are involved, that doesn't give rise to Somebody taking their hands to a woman in a hot tub, an unclothed woman, that tea with an unknown substance right there beside them. That some Shorts with that underwear, is right there on the steps. And that her body lay in there, and her arms, floating. None of that gives rise to show that Marcus Lillard did this, and you have to come to that decision. Was it the 69 year old man, who was going through some trouble, he was doing a lot of drugs, or was it her boyfriend who was out the woods, got eaten alive by insects, and got proof of it and stayed there and went through the most grueling interviews and still never said something he didn't do. And I implore you to go back and see the same thing we saw, and come out and do what you have to do to tell what you saw. And what you know happened and find Marcus Lillard not guilty of murder. Not guilty on aggravated assault. He didn't strangle her. Not guilty on involuntary murder; reckless conduct. He did everything he could, and it was not a gross deviation. When you come back out, I know y'all will see the same thing I did. And you will have to an answer that I have, and that you've learned through this whole trial, that he's not guilty. He didn't, he's not guilty of murder. Not guilty of agg. assault. Not guilty of involuntary manslaughter and not guilty of reckless conduct. And let him start to put his life back together. Thank you.

 

Penny  37:56

This is the final word from the defense. In the next episode, we'll hear the state's closing arguments and the verdict. Join Patreon at patreon.com/bloodtown for early access and bonus content. Or leave a rating or review on Apple podcasts, Good Pods or Spotify. You can visit our website bloodtownpodcast.com or follow us on Facebook or Instagram at bloodtownpodcast and on Twitter @bloodtownpod